Anti-cheat

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Ryu Makkuro
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Re: Anti-cheat

Postby Ryu Makkuro » Fri May 13, 2016 1:33 pm

Skid wrote:The main thing to worry about when implementing cheat protection is to try and have the server sanity check values coming in, IE a car shouldn't be able to accelerate from 0 to 700kps in a second, and check the cars not going faster then a sane max speed. That sort of thing.

Well, you say sane, but this whole game is the definition of insanity xD
On a more serious note though, getting over the max speed can be caused by glitches, collisions, etc. And going from 0 to 700km/h in a second probably will not be that rare when someone will smack into you (after you've been reduced to 0 from an Assassin) while being under influence of double turbo or something along those lines.
Another thing is that sanity check would be great if you would be 100% sure that the physics wouldn't glitch out and something wouldn't cause those weird situations. Otherwise it may lead to a lot of unfair bans which can lead to bad reception in the community and/or a flood of threads on the forum asking for a unbanning due to being banned from game bugging out.

Usually I'm all in for radical solutions to fair play issues (they work tremendously well even though most people don't like to admit it), but in GRIP case the performance is quite honestly too insane for any form of sanity check and other radical methods to work. Which is kind of ironic, because for how savage and "unsophisticated" its gameplay is, it requires highly sophisticated methods to deal with any fair play issues.
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Skid
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Re: Anti-cheat

Postby Skid » Fri May 13, 2016 1:56 pm

Well you wouldn't instantly ban / kick for going beyond what the normal limits are, but for consistently or repeatedly doing it. For example work out what the fastest cars max speed under boost, in a straight line, and if a player is doing that for like 5-10 seconds straight then something is up, sanity checks should include leeway for edge cases. The easiest way for hackers to cheat is modify thing like acceleration and speed on the client side, and monitoring that thought-out the course of a race is the easiest way to detect them.

You would out if someone is cheating over a period of time and then do something about them. The other way of doing things is if players can host their own games, or dedicated servers are a thing, allow the admin / host to ban people from the server.
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Ryu Makkuro
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Re: Anti-cheat

Postby Ryu Makkuro » Fri May 13, 2016 2:12 pm

Skid wrote:Well you wouldn't instantly ban / kick for going beyond what the normal limits are, but for consistently or repeatedly doing it. For example work out what the fastest cars max speed under boost, in a straight line, and if a player is doing that for like 5-10 seconds straight then something is up, sanity checks should include leeway for edge cases. The easiest way for hackers to cheat is modify thing like acceleration and speed on the client side, and monitoring that thought-out the course of a race is the easiest way to detect them.

Yeah, but 10% better acceleration won't be really noticed through any "sanity check" while it's more than enough to make sure you can win any race if you're good enough. The blatant cheaters are the smallest problem (as you pointed out with your example), it's those that cheat while being able to compete without those at the highest or close to that level that are the true issue.
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Skid
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Re: Anti-cheat

Postby Skid » Fri May 13, 2016 2:52 pm

10% better acceleration isn't enough to compensate for someone with better skill, blatant cheaters are by fair the most annoying and are the ones that will be complained about the most and the loudest, they are also the easiest to detect. Just because smaller cheaters wouldn't trigger this kind of check doesn't mean it's a bad idea and shouldn't be implemented, the methods required to detect that kind of cheater are significantly more complex. Detecting other processes being attached to the exe would require a white list be made for every other legitimate process, of every type (virus scanned, anything that adds an overlay, screen capture software, voip chat systems, etc).
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Ryu Makkuro
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Re: Anti-cheat

Postby Ryu Makkuro » Fri May 13, 2016 3:06 pm

Skid wrote:10% better acceleration isn't enough to compensate for someone with better skill, blatant cheaters are by fair the most annoying and are the ones that will be complained about the most and the loudest, they are also the easiest to detect. Just because smaller cheaters wouldn't trigger this kind of check doesn't mean it's a bad idea and shouldn't be implemented, the methods required to detect that kind of cheater are significantly more complex. Detecting other processes being attached to the exe would require a white list be made for every other legitimate process, of every type (virus scanned, anything that adds an overlay, screen capture software, voip chat systems, etc).

Depends on the difference in skill. If someone is like I mentioned near the top level, it's more than enough to guarantee the win every single time. The worse someone is, the bigger that performance increase has to be.

Blatant cheaters while most complained, won't be the ones that are actually "feared". Those will get banned sooner or later, while the ones that are hard to detect will keep on racing and will eventually put the seeds of doubt and will be destroying community from inside out. Competition is the back bone of every single racing game and those hard to detect ones are always where the competition is.

Also, I didn't said the sanity check shouldn't be implemented. I simply pointed out that it won't be enough to combat the cheaters. The white listing anti-cheats are not all there are and they aren't 100% effective, as in they don't always block the programs that aren't white listed.
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