My suggestions for Acrophobia

Here you give us specific suggestions on how you think the private release can be improved.

This isn't for bug reports, this is for features (example: wrong way indicator)
Costa
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My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby Costa » Sun Jul 02, 2017 7:11 pm

Hello, i wanna share my thoughs and hopes about improving this track with a very few but essentials suggestion that might enhance this track a little bit. Please take note :mrgreen:

lets get started.
This is the spawn. Absolutley nothing to say, its just fine and looks good. Good job!
20170702235336_1.jpg
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About these jump pads.... im okay with them, but so far, most of the time wasted reaching them with the jump, doesnt worth it, like you can go straight with the main trackflow and you probably gonna go faster instead of using them, maybe make them a little bit powerful should balance them if possible
20170702235407_1.jpg
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At the end of the tunnel, this adjoint area looks weird/unpolished, i think it can be improved, maybe make it a bit smoother. This is the #1 issue of random unattended jump/backflips most of the time, especially on high speed. The straight track just ahead of the track missing the forcefields on both sides,wich makes you go thru the rocks. please fix.
20170702235433_2.jpg
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After reaching the first jump, you should be able to choose your path between the ramps but.....heres the problem: in order to reach the lower area, you have to slow down too much, reaching something like 150-250km/h, wich it will never gonna happen until you really, really want to use your breaks on a straight line during a race. My suggestion is to place the lower area to the left, paraller to the upper one, giving you the ability to choose quickly wich path youre about to take. if you take the left down one, you will waste more time by doing a larger turn, but it will compensate with the upcoming series of speedpads wich should give a considerable valuable option.
20170702235820_1.jpg
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This is an intresting one. I might suggest to improve this second landing jump area with another floor under the main trackone. Adding another floor just like the first earlier jump.
20170702235840_1.jpg
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You will be able to choose where to land and if youre going on the lower one, you will be able to go upside down like in this area (maybe adding a few speedpads, coming out on this lower area (im driving in reverse to just show the area):
20170702235914_1.jpg
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Costa
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby Costa » Sun Jul 02, 2017 7:11 pm

About this alternate vertical path.....its way too risky to consider pick this one, especially if you wanna take the path and return back. It work 15-20% of the time, but that because most probably the angle is not smooth enought, a smoother curve entrance/exit of this section might solve the issue, making the decision to pick this path more valuable since you will have more "GRIP" during the coming in/coming out phase.
20170702235929_1.jpg
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Then you reach this whole area wich is....somewhat wasted. like, litherally. i was thinking about a very intresting concept, here how it should be:
20170702235953_1.jpg
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Once you reach this area, you can basicly pick 2 paths: on the left side, fill them with containers/small labs wich you can pass between them, but makes you slow down (going for a zig zag thinghy between containers), or alternatively, going fullspeed ahead, and pick a long turn (something like speedbowl turn at full speed. Heres the idea prespective from the top:
20170703000622_1.jpg
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And this is the ending zone.....i noticed lots of players landing basicly on the forcefield due to max speed reached after the jump........how about place some kind of extra straight track that makes a turn and finish with a final jumping ramp like so? (maybe adding a whole big antenna to circumnavigate instead? it might be intresting....
20170703000036_1.jpg
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That's it. i hope these changes will be taken in consideration about to improve this track, let me know thanks
Last edited by Costa on Thu Jul 06, 2017 1:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Queadah
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby Queadah » Mon Jul 03, 2017 2:44 am

The part where it read "another floor under the main trackone. Adding another floor just like the first earlier jump" kinda bugs me:
  • GRIP rigs can drive on ceilings
  • no need for those extra ramps!!
  • just let us drive BELOW THE EXISTING ONES!!
This game mechanics is quite underused on that track imo

Costa
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby Costa » Mon Jul 03, 2017 3:08 pm

Queadah wrote:The part where it read "another floor under the main trackone. Adding another floor just like the first earlier jump" kinda bugs me:
  • GRIP rigs can drive on ceilings
  • no need for those extra ramps!!
  • just let us drive BELOW THE EXISTING ONES!!
This game mechanics is quite underused on that track imo


For sure you can use the existing one, but when you landing in the deeper one, you will need at least another floor (20-50 mt at least of a secondary floor), then you can actually move up drive below the existing one........i still like the ideas i mentioned earlier, i think give the track more "pepper" and more over all game/track sense

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Tathendal
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby Tathendal » Tue Jul 04, 2017 1:58 pm

Some cool suggestions, especially the last two! These kinds of things would make tracks more interesting!

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Rathori
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby Rathori » Sat Jul 08, 2017 4:16 pm

Costa wrote:After reaching the first jump, you should be able to choose your path between the ramps but.....heres the problem: in order to reach the lower area, you have to slow down too much, reaching something like 150-250km/h, wich it will never gonna happen until you really, really want to use your breaks on a straight line during a race.

I thought so too, until just now. It turns out, if you're going very fast, your car will lift-off at the spot where the track starts going down - this usually happens anyway, messing up your jump preparation - BUT, if you're going REALLY fast, your car won't touch the track after it lifts off.. until it lands right in that lower area with the booster pads!

In case anybody is interested, I was driving a Terra Dominator when it happened. I will try to replicate it and record it on video, but no promises.

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Rathori
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby Rathori » Sun Jul 09, 2017 7:55 am



I did it again! It seems to depend not only on your speed but also on your trajectory, you have to sort of keep to right side of the track. Not quite as smooth as the first time I did it, but you get the idea.

I don't know how to edit videos recorded with GeForce Experience (yet), so jump to 2:20 for the jump, hehe.

Costa
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby Costa » Thu Aug 03, 2017 4:13 pm

Arrright folks...its time for a revision about my suggestions after the changes made, because why not?

First of all, THANK you for apply a few changes to this track, now looks overall quite better, but still needs just a few improvments to make it on a good level of joy.

So heres a few extra changes that i would like to make it happen + extra bonus....

I really liked the new zone like in this picture, now we can choose wich part of the ramp to go, its quite effective and well made, congrats! its in the right place in the right time of the track, excellent choice (its also visually great, no issues at all):
20170803181446_1.jpg
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Now this part....i really want to try make it simple, hoping my idea will like for someone else......basicly i was thinking about making this area more "acrobatics", like litherally.....essentially my idea is to extend the first part of the floating track with a twist......then put a bit back the final ramp....here the reason: i wanna make the landing zone in 2 way for landing, the upper one and the lower one..... linking the lower zone to the jump at mid track down there......here an image that should represent my idea:

20170803173618_1.jpg
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Image

How that looks? i think its worth it a try.

Now.... i wanna talk about this area after the straight track......it still unclear about the flow, i guess we need to rethink it because so far it could be a bit confusing, the signs are a bit far away, and there are shields in the middle of the track, then other track parts a bit random........ i was thinking about make the center area some kind of minicourse, then put the track in a certain moment of path choose, like advise the player wich path to go, maybe something like this (just an example, dont take it seriously):

20170803181426_1.jpg
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About the new alternative road, i think needs an improvement, i personally im not a big fan of the forced jump, i know its to compensate the right times, but i would rader make some kind of "spring" circuit around a mountain to compensate times, and balance them with the right amount of speed pads, here is one of my ideas so far (basicly a loop around the mountain in vertical (because acrophobia track), filled with speed pads, longer path, dangerous but worth it):

20170803181907_1.jpg
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For the final jump, i noticed one thing: quite often, while jump, cars tend to land on the very left zone next to the start/finish line , crashing into the finish line, with full jump, can we move the jumping ramp a little bit to the right to compensate that?

20170803182411_1.jpg
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Alright here my second revision about the updates made on acrophobia, as always, let me know what you think about these potential changes to make this map more exciting and dangerous

Ps. Whats with the fog right next to the final ramp? can it be reduced? it seems too visible to me, maybe add more distace for that?
Last edited by Costa on Thu Aug 03, 2017 5:18 pm, edited 3 times in total.

TheOnLY
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby TheOnLY » Thu Aug 03, 2017 4:54 pm

I agree with the changes proposed in last two images.I don't like that route at all. For the 3rd image: I really dont like the artificial limitation of the track by blue barriers and the optimal line is much closer to the left than the blue barriers are.

Costa
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby Costa » Thu Aug 03, 2017 5:07 pm

TheOnLY wrote:I agree with the changes proposed in last two images.I don't like that route at all. For the 3rd image: I really dont like the artificial limitation of the track by blue barriers and the optimal line is much closer to the left than the blue barriers are.

ikr, but as you can see its kinda difficult to assign that square area the right place, i mean, its something undefined, lacks of content, with the barriers filled with something its guides you around that place, it gives a shape to that area, it shouldnt be a problem. the optimal line will be calibrated with the right amount of speed pads with the main one, but needs testing. I perosnally dont like the green forced barriers jump at all, the combat aspect is enought on this track, adding these barries gves me a bit of concerns.....

What do you think about the first part? i would like to see if its possible to make these extra changes, the actual lower ramp after landing is quite pointless imo, they need to make it usable by lowering and linking to the ramp:
Image

twisted
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby twisted » Mon Aug 07, 2017 9:55 am

I think all those changes are not needed, track is good as it is currently.

- The second ramp will split again even more the players, that's not a good idea. The players are already separated by these two different routes, which is enough.

- The big open area idea is to make a 180 degree drift there, I don't like the blue shields as I think it will limit the players movement and how you want to enter that turn to initiate a drift, there's really no need to guide the players there. Free open space adds variety, there is not many in the game. I think the spacelab/containers idea is good though.

- I'm really a fan of the forced jumps, the game needs even more. it's quite hard to take it correctly so it adds risk to that path. it forces you to slowdown to align carefully. The big turn around you're suggesting will make this route waaay too slow. It is suppose to be a shortcut.

- The final jump is meant to be taken completely on the far right. You must probably jump from the left of the vertical platform, that's why you end up in the wrong landing zone. I've never landed there, and can land on the main route very consistently so you must be doing something wrong.

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Broscar
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby Broscar » Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:29 am

Hey Costa,

First up, we really appreciate your thread and the work you put into creating all those screenshots to back your suggestions. Thanks man :)

Agro is a work in progress and your feedback is taken into consideration when adjusting it. Stuff like the path on the side of the road after the big loop not allowing clean re-entry to the main road is pretty important and should be changed.

Adding alternate paths for effectively the same stretch of road could be a waste of development time. Does it actually benefit gameplay or does it just look cool? If we add too many alternate paths (that block sight on other routes), racers will be split up constantly, so they have to provide different experiences that are just as exciting as the main road to actually be worth taking. Adding a second road beneath the main path to circumvent the split right after the big loop makes for a clustered design that diminishes the main road. Slapping the big loop, +main road with split design, +2nd road underneath with potentially another obstacle all together means too much is happening in that small space.

Adding obstacles to the big square area you think is wasted space is something I think most veteran racers can agree with, but it'll also frustrate a lot of people, so a balance has to be found. Or more of a solution in the form of adding obstacles that slow racers down but don't punish too harshly when failed, I guess. Skill levels vary greatly and some people don't want to hear this, but GRIP has to be playable for more than just the top 20% of gamers.
I can't really tell what'll happen to the big square area yet, but know we definitely read and keep in mind your suggestions.

As for crashing into the finish line when exiting the alternate path at the end; the alternate path has been removed, in part for reasons mentioned above. It might come back, we don't know yet, but for now at least I can say you won't have to worry about crashing into the finish line anymore ;p

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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby playabot » Thu Aug 10, 2017 10:23 pm

The big square would function well as a spaceship docking bay. This would add eye candy to the area and to give function to its form. I don’t mean that space craft would land on the pad but that they would come to rest hovering beside, around and over it... perhaps tethered to it (re fuelling or something). I understand this might take a bit of art work but it won’t affect the flow of the track… only function as dressing.

There may not be a need for obstacles to be added to the square itself though some could certainly be dotted around with consideration to the above mentioned aesthetic i.e. maybe cargo containers and fuel lines. Perhaps power up placement on this area could encourage racers to stray from the standard (or fastest) racing line and offer up some risk/reward gameplay.

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Queadah
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby Queadah » Fri Aug 11, 2017 6:30 pm

(+1 Costa on that underside gif)

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Broscar
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby Broscar » Fri Aug 11, 2017 7:40 pm

That sounds pretty damn interesting, playabot. Maybe a docking station for the various craft keeping parts of the Acrophobia road up?

twisted
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby twisted » Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:32 pm

How about a shortcut ramp in the loop launching the player there? MAybe it could be fun. :D

Image

TheOnLY
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby TheOnLY » Sat Aug 12, 2017 7:58 am

Don't need a ramp for that, just hope for the car to clip :twisted:
It's like a surprise ramp :D

Costa
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby Costa » Sun Aug 13, 2017 4:07 pm

From my POV, acrophobia is classified as HARD track, wich means difficult. Having good nerves/reflex to choose a path is fundamental in races/combat scenarios. here my personal advantages by choosing to implement more alternative paths:

- Vary gameplay, you can choose wich path to take, making races/combat more intresting less boring
- Ability to pick items by using another path. When several player are playing, its quite difficult pick items if if youre last and the track have only one flow. think about it. Speed bowl is a perfect example of mediocre.
- Excellent assassin evading menouvre/overall good method to escape if someone is chasing you.

I recommends implement these changes and see what happens, we are testing and im confident in what ive wrote, i played a lot this track. its a sad thing they gonna remove the altenate path at the end, it was an excellent example of my first idea.

One last thing, the "alternative" paths doesnt means cars will be separated, sometime car pick the same path, and most of these separate path doesnt take longer than a couple of seconds, like 4 - 5 seconds max.

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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby playabot » Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:06 pm

Broscar wrote:That sounds pretty damn interesting, playabot. Maybe a docking station for the various craft keeping parts of the Acrophobia road up?


Yeah man, that could work :) I like things like that... ading elements that ad to the story or history of a location. Less walls and artifical boundaries.

I understand that walls and boundaries play a part in keeping newbies on the track but I think that there is another way to easily educate players about some of the hazards on track befor they come across them. I might write that up on another subject though.

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Queadah
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Re: My suggestions for Acrophobia

Postby Queadah » Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:15 am

playabot wrote:
Broscar wrote:adding elements that ad to the story or history of a location. Less walls and artifical boundaries.

Agreed. There's a clear lack of more organic ones (walls and boundaries).
Norvos is ice planet, there are lots of assets you'd expect from that (iceberg sides, icefloe, stalactites, stalagmites, clear ice structures etc...)


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