Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

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Clean&Clear
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Re: Islands track - suggestions

Postby Clean&Clear » Thu Jan 05, 2017 7:21 am

Broscar wrote:
I love that Islands has multiple routes and visually it's a strong map.
Despite this, it's very boring to drive on.

The track is quite flat, very wide, has long stretches of driving straight ahead and there's barely any corners that actually require the player to tilt their analog sticks more than 5 degrees.
On top of that the routes tend to separate the racers too much.


Strongly agree with this one, especially the "the routes tend to separate the racers too much" and "has long stretches of driving straight ahead". The latter is a problem I have with more tracks in the game so far, as I feel they don't occupy the player with driving enough. My most favourite track is Yuri, as I feel I always have something to do on the track and there are no blind spots there. IMO, Alhatra, that's a great track, but should be considered an easy track, and then other tracks could be compared to it in terms of difficulty.

Generally I think the track design could be a bit more "courageous" in terms of gameplay. From Islands I really like the part starting with exiting the tunnel into the ceiling drive, than taking the ramps to get on the ground and then the wide part with terrain leveling and avoiding the pillars afterwards. I know the tracks can't just be sections like this all the time, but I think right now there are too many just straight parts with very little input required.

Anyway, keep up the great work devs! :)

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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby 0Blueaura » Thu Jan 05, 2017 2:00 pm

More routes through the water, pls. I love to splash My car
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Chris_CE
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Re: Islands track - suggestions

Postby Chris_CE » Thu Jan 05, 2017 9:36 pm

I agree that the Islands map needs more things to keep the player engaged, and that the players are split up a bit too much. If all the routes were within eyesight of each other then it wouldn't be so isolating, but right now there's a lot of separation. Wonder if I can make the tunnel route an open cave section that connects with the far left route somehow. Even if you can just see the cars on other paths periodically, it'll do well to make players not feel alone

It certainly can feel boring it parts due to long stretches of straight, and yes, I found driving on the underside of the bridge to be the worst of it, but mainly because the bridge asset is really ugly. Perhaps to increase intensity, the underside could have plenty of thin ramps for swerving around (unless you want to get off the bridge)

I think what I'll do is a bunch of paintovers of the map with potential changes and run it by the team as well as to you guys in this thread

@kmac: Jef nor I have added any signage to the map yet, so indeed, it's hard to tell where to go

Queadah wrote:The new one on the right side (more of a wall ride), right of the boosted jump in the middle of the road, after the U turn. On the right upper path.

What do you not like about the wallride there? I believe it's quicker than the normal upper route as it has a speedpad, and the thin ramp on the end allows players to roll their car to a smoother landing
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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby Chris_CE » Thu Jan 05, 2017 9:36 pm

Clean&Clear wrote:Generally I think the track design could be a bit more "courageous" in terms of gameplay.

I agree, and it's why I made Skytrack quickly with pure gameplay in mind (could still be better). We're a bit late to realizing the potential of the car's design, or rather I think it's because there was so much to do that sometimes tracks were rushed. Not that our tracks are inherently bad, but they certainly could take more advantage of the car's unique mechanics

0Blueaura wrote:More routes through the water, pls. I love to splash My car

Indeed would be cool. The jump to the far left route on the beach after the glass tunnel could be flattened and mostly shallow water to drive thourgh (with small humps as mini jumps)
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Queadah
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Re: Islands track - suggestions

Postby Queadah » Fri Jan 06, 2017 8:53 am

I tend to agree with Broscar in totality, mostly:
Broscar wrote:routes tend to separate the racers too much.


Below is how we'd force people on the bridge area to pack everyone yet have wide spaces.
The beach route could be the equivalent of the Yuri hard shortcut, slightly difficult to discover + speedpads reward in it (destructible coconut palms?).

Image

In reverse, I think the left road and tunnel make the map too short, hence, force people on the outter beach route and allow for a natural turn & jump on ceiling trick:
Image
The orange ramp, like in Carkour-job site, is a ramp rotating down upon pillars destruction.

This way, you get upside down action on the beach!
Image

Bonus: reverse Island gets to feel different than normal.
Last edited by Queadah on Fri Jan 06, 2017 4:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby 0Blueaura » Fri Jan 06, 2017 12:22 pm

Maybe the bridges floor should be a destructible glass?

so like, the driver on the bridge can use untargeted rockets to destroy the floor and drop down for the reminder of the race, or the player from below the bridge can lock on to players and while it doesnt hit the player it hits the floor.
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Queadah
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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby Queadah » Sat Jan 07, 2017 1:46 pm

Alright Gentlemen. It is that time again:
Image
(photoshop not finished) the bridge asset is good, but we need that dam in our lives ^^
Cue in a Kraken right below for us to dodge tentacles and voila!

Plus we get verticality. The glass tunnel can be down there, splashed by water/underwater and guide us upward!
The other path can remain with the tree, but down below in the moist with some giant fungus ;)
Image

kingbeandip
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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby kingbeandip » Sat Jan 07, 2017 4:47 pm

It doesn't have to be a dam, per se (which would have a river running through it, which would make little sense on an island). It can just be a levee.

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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby KazzyMac » Sun Jan 08, 2017 9:06 am

That idea of the dam/levee sounds pretty interesting. Could spice it up by having little cracks in it spewing/tricking out water across the track?

On the flipside it also gives the car something else to drive on? :P
Image

Look at the road-holding on these babies. Clarkson would cream himself. :ugeek:

Broscar, your car skin is called Tropical. ; )

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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby 0Blueaura » Sun Jan 08, 2017 11:30 am

I Think it would look cool if at the starting line on the right side, the plaza would be a bit deeper so you could add water spewing out of the rocky wall:

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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby maniamaster » Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:58 pm

all nice ideas visually, but we really need to focus on gameplay only for now. Really. Especially with this track, the gameplay needs much improvement, for reasons mentioned above. Deal with that first and afterwards I'm sure the artist will give us a nice looking map. Adapt the scenery tot he layout, not vice versa.

My top complaints about this map are: Way too wide, way too straight, very little variety (layout wise).
I would consider cutting-pasting some sections of this map but redesigning the layout (adding more curves). Or maybe start with "shrinking" some parts.

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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby Queadah » Mon Jan 09, 2017 1:12 pm

0Blueaura wrote:the plaza would be a bit deeper so you could add water spewing out of the rocky wall:

+1 At least making it deeper indeed. The map is quite flat... and who knows, if we can get that dam... :P

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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby The Sudden Silent » Tue Jan 10, 2017 1:22 am

i uploaded some images version 1.1.2.0 and 1.1.7.0 version liddo5 island track reverse mode
liddo island images here -->> http://imgur.com/a/e3WLR

all screenshots where appear pos /10 is 1.1.7.0 version
and if there see /4 that is 1.1.2.0 version screenshot.

images show biggest layout changes on tracks between these 2 versions and many other changes what you cant see on normal mode

--------differences----------
1.1.2.0
versions only 3 AI car and AI not move.
start gate is missing on reverse mode
there is no any pick ups.
there is no any turbo boost tabs.
near glass tunnel there is no force barrier
there is some ramps what you cant see on normal route in 1.1.2.0 version ((only appear reverse mode))
some route sign appear (( only appear reverse mode ))


1.1.7.0
there is 9 AI and AI moving, but they driving normal route.
start gate is missing on reverse mode
there is no any pick ups.
there is no any turbo boost tabs.
near glass tunnel there is no force barrier
there is no longer these ramps what appear on 1.1.2.0 versions.
some route sign appear (( only appear reverse mode ))
Last edited by The Sudden Silent on Thu Jan 12, 2017 9:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Clean&Clear
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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby Clean&Clear » Tue Jan 10, 2017 5:10 am

maniamaster wrote:all nice ideas visually, but we really need to focus on gameplay only for now. Really. Especially with this track, the gameplay needs much improvement, for reasons mentioned above. Deal with that first and afterwards I'm sure the artist will give us a nice looking map. Adapt the scenery to the layout, not vice versa.


Exactly.

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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby Chris_CE » Tue Jan 10, 2017 2:06 pm

Here's some images I made yesterday.

#1: pretty sel-explanatory

#2: The glass tunnel (placeholder asset btw) simply wasn't working very well. I'm thinking we ditch the tunnel altogether and have the cars driving inside a building complex together, having the choice of floor, wall or ceiling, or smashing out the left side through glass

#3: section where I say flatten could just be a lower jump, or split into two paths, one higher and one lower

#4: Huge rework of this area. Rip out the terrain and rocks in favour of a building complex that has two routes going below and one going above... or two, depending on if the far right lower route can go through the building and connect to the bridge on the far left. If that happens, I'd make that bridge a wallride instead, so cars on there can be targeted, and it's trickier to navigate.
The structure would be up on piers below, with shallow water like so: https://gyazo.com/09951367bce9aa9b471560824215a61c
Then the lower routes can either connect or go their own way, but also need to watch out for the pillars

#5 and #6: when players exit the structure area they have plenty of choices. The lower right route is fastest underneath, so it has an s-turn on the beach. The top routes are a bit too quick maybe, so may have to possibly drop them off the bridges either sooner or angle them to the side so that they need to make a turn to get to the bridge entrance at the end of the beach.

The far left (#4,5) or top left route that comes out from under the rocks (#6) will need easily hit speedpads to stay competitive

Overall, there will be quite a lot of changes to this map to improve variety, challenge and flow.

These are just ideas in these images, ideas that are obviously open for discussion ;)
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The Sudden Silent
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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby The Sudden Silent » Tue Jan 10, 2017 5:57 pm

When would be possible to get the changes to the game?
At present, the biggest problem is the balance of the various routes, some routes are very slow compared to others, or are otherwise bad.
Photos 4 5 and 6 could fix some of the problems in those sections the track.


and small question can we cut these parts out?

The railing of the bridge seems a bit pointless at that point levels. and well before them in the fencing will see the track a bit too cramped. Many times I've seen that AI also run up to the fence at that point
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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby 0Blueaura » Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:59 pm

I want an easter egg with that bridge to the other island, some kind of dev room.

S-route seems like a great idea, about the factory instead of a glass tube, i will draw the interior and try my best :P

meanwhile I've drawn an idea for a dam, Since i was discussing about it with Queadah: Image
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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby twisted » Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:13 pm

@Chris If only we had that freeroam camera, having a global view of the track would help come up with nice suggestions.

#3 Don't know if it would work but that yellow slope could be a skate ramp where you can jump off from the side to reach a higher platform above it leading to an alternate route.

I'm also eager to experience yet my first loop-the-loop in the game. finger crossed it's something coming at some point in the future :)

Overall, very nice ideas you got there. Driving in building interiors breaking glasses and avoiding pillars sounds insanely fun!

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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby kingbeandip » Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:51 pm

Today I tried playing this track in reverse, and it seems to work just fine for the most part. So when it is finished, I hope you will also release a reverse version.

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Re: Liddo5 Islands track feedback thread

Postby XT3 » Wed Jan 11, 2017 6:22 pm

4. Ok that idea I like. What about it being a multi story building that you drive up into the third floor instead of it being the roof?


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