Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

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twisted
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Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby twisted » Sat Dec 31, 2016 9:59 pm

Hi Chris and team,

I am a huge fan of your game. I have played the game extensively lately and come up with some great ideas I think :)

Transport MAP

Since the last few updates, some says the Transport map is too easy. I think it would be fun to avoid a moving train coming from a tunnel and going to the ground alongside the tunnel. Also, the train would force us to use ramps on the side when exiting the tunnel which would be fun. Ah, and those big barrier/doors could open and close for an added layer of difficulty... I think overall we need more moving obstacles.

Image
Image
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Alhatra MAP

I think this area could benefit from more verticality and be used to it's fullest potential by adding a twisting ramp above the ground and going between the electrical pylon field.

Image
Image
Image

Let me know what you think!
Last edited by twisted on Tue Jan 03, 2017 11:55 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Queadah
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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby Queadah » Sun Jan 01, 2017 6:04 am

twisted wrote:Image

OMFG that 1st screenshot is what we need!
+9999 change the random horizontal pillars into this conveyor belt with boxes moving on it (so it remains flat and doesn't take all the space over it)!! Genius :idea:

As I posted this some time ago, a train could also be here (in the future):
Image

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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby twisted » Sun Jan 01, 2017 8:34 am

Yeah, a conveyor belt could be probably more appropriate to suit that enclosed space and it could be made of any size, no need to worry about scale like with a train, good point.

What would be fun is riding along it as we have to twist around upside down, and to the left, etc to avoid it as it's location could alternate between the middle of the tunnel, to the ground, and exit the circle tunnel and re-enter it at an angle from different places just as the picture you reposted shows.

And oh my god, that train you posted is... just perfect looking and fits really well, add some jumps here and there to avoid it and everything is looking good! ;)

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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby Chris_CE » Thu Jan 05, 2017 9:44 pm

hey Twisted

The moving train along the length of the tunnel has been mentioned before and is certainly a cool idea, but our AI cannot handle something like that currently. We could add some avoidance volumes to the animated train but I think it needs to be more intelligent than that or you're going to see AI crashing all over the place

As for obstacles, I had some in the map prior to this, but the majority of players hated them. Especially ones that almost stopped you dead. Ideally we need destructible obstacles that simply slow down the player, not screw them up completely. Then they are worth avoiding, but aren't too punishing. I do like the idea of bridges across, which I've always wanted, but we need to make sure they don't stop players dead either, and rather deflect

For that circular train yard (Que's image), the only way that would work is if only 50% of the track was blocked at any given time, so racers (AI included) can avoid the train properly

RE: Alhatra

I like the idea of an alternate route going through the antenna graveyard, but I'm not sure it's worthwhile. I'd have to experiment
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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby iamthatiam » Fri Jan 06, 2017 5:17 am

I like these ideas. I find the current tracks too easy; they need more personality, lots more twists and turns, ups and downs.

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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby agcue » Thu Feb 23, 2017 8:31 am

Transport definitely needs a major re work, but I'm not one to vote for more obstacles in the tunnels - even the ones there currently bring you to a dead stop.

In my opinion the track drab or at least, a bit boring - a bit like islands is currently, but not as boring! (very harsh there, sorry)

I wouldn't mind seeing the tunnels bank, dip, raise and drop more prominently - not exactly like, but kind of like the rock tunnel on FIC outpost. I like the way that your momentum carries you up the wall as you enter that tunnel. It kind of arcs along the natural line that your vehicle takes. Its both functionally interesting and visually interesting. Any obstacles could be added to areas off this natural racing line so that the player feels that they are naturally flowing past them (hard to do when hit by a rocket! but anyway...)

Its not just the tunnels that I think need work. Sections outside, joining the tunnels, aren't interesting either. Maybe the bridge over the body of water could be widened or, better yet, banked. And other sections could offer some alternate routes, and again banks and turns that compliment a natural line.

I think that the tunnels need to be made more 'rollercoastery' and possibly a bit shorter and the sections outside need to be made longer, more spacious and interesting.

On a side note, is Liddo 5 still planned to be covered in jungle?

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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby Chris_CE » Sun Feb 26, 2017 3:38 pm

I wouldn't say transport needs a major rework, but it certainly needs work in general

The tunnel before the first exit jump needs reshaping to be more curving and interesting, promoting barrel rolls. It will no doubt feel more natural that way. Plus there will be strategically placed speedpads for speedster class to take advantage of. Having objects to the side of racing lines is a good idea, as long as they don't stop players dead or nearly dead.

Not sure I agree with the bridge over the water needing to be wider and banked, to me thats even more boring as it would be easier. Haveing the bridge start a bit earlier and then have a slight S curve in it could be cool though, which would take some skill and drifting to navigate.

The islands map will use a bunch of jungle assets, but the map "Flow101" which is coming later, will be covered in jungle
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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby agcue » Wed Mar 01, 2017 10:07 am

Chris_CE wrote:I wouldn't say transport needs a major rework, but it certainly needs work in general

The tunnel before the first exit jump needs reshaping to be more curving and interesting, promoting barrel rolls. It will no doubt feel more natural that way. Plus there will be strategically placed speedpads for speedster class to take advantage of. Having objects to the side of racing lines is a good idea, as long as they don't stop players dead or nearly dead.

Not sure I agree with the bridge over the water needing to be wider and banked, to me thats even more boring as it would be easier. Haveing the bridge start a bit earlier and then have a slight S curve in it could be cool though, which would take some skill and drifting to navigate.

The islands map will use a bunch of jungle assets, but the map "Flow101" which is coming later, will be covered in jungle


Fair call on all above...

I think my main issue with that bridge is actually an aesthetic one, but yeah, I'm not a huge fan of the thin width and tendency to bounce between the sides sometimes (I know its not to dissimilar from assets on other maps its just the sides really block out your view - and I like a good view). So I guess;

how about, at minimum, allowing vehicles to ride on the banks as they are by removing the inner barrier on this asset? Little bit more width to pass, and drivers would tend to stick to the centre regardless but you know just have a bit more room to move if needed.

and I would just love to see that lake used to better effect, as it is you fly by without even knowing its there. Could be quite visually arresting and ad to the interest of the track to frame it better - Would be cool if there were an alternate route to the right of that bridge entry to drive through/around the body of water and meet up with the rest of the track after the second tunnel exit (though I get that this would separate racers for a good while). OR instead of riding the bridge like a normal bridge how about setting it up so vehicles ramp onto the underside of the bridge? lake would be in full view then :geek: and this sort of thing works well on other tracks. The bridge would then meet up with the top of the tunnel rather than the bottom. If you come unstuck from the bridge the alternate route could come into play???? OR just bank that mother!!! 8-)

in any case looking forward to seeing what you do with this track (and islands) and yeah can't wait to see the jungle assets!

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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby adams » Wed Mar 01, 2017 4:57 pm

It looks like there's a way to drive to the right of the bridge

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_H79C0uXKQE

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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby Chris_CE » Sat Mar 11, 2017 1:53 pm

Bridge is fixed next patch

As for the marsh, there's still a possibility to have it integrated into the track. Just not a priority right now. Would be a good thing to update later and keep the track fresh
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agcue
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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby agcue » Thu May 18, 2017 9:38 am

Any chance the barriers in the tunnels, particularly the segmented brick wall ones (that stop you dead), can be removed entirely?? Alternatively replace them with tree roots or vines? I don't really know that much about UE4 but vines/roots could absorb some speed but not stop your rig dead... They could also tare down on impact which could be cool... watching vehicles tare through them.

The track is looking great by the by. Trusting the iterative process :)

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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby Costa » Mon May 22, 2017 4:12 pm

The main problem of transport is about missing secondary/alternative roads, i might suggest start a second path down the outside long bridge, that area is empty, and you can pass under the bridge and enter into a mini transport tunnel or something....its just an idea how to fill the map with alternative routes

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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby Chris_CE » Mon May 22, 2017 5:02 pm

Indeed Transport could use some alternative routes, even if they're right next to each other.

One issue with a track like FIC Outpost or Industrial is that the alternate routes completely separate the racers, and therefore decrease interaction and excitement
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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby Costa » Mon May 22, 2017 5:49 pm

Chris_CE wrote:Indeed Transport could use some alternative routes, even if they're right next to each other.

One issue with a track like FIC Outpost or Industrial is that the alternate routes completely separate the racers, and therefore decrease interaction and excitement

im not sure about that. the ability to choose the path its something intresting in combat scenario, dodge assassin by using another path, or avoid combat in general, it might also been used to catchup someone or other purposes, and if i remember correctly transport and acrofobia are the only one without a secondary path.....to me i think every track should have at least one at some point, just to vary the gameplay

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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby agcue » Thu May 25, 2017 3:57 am

Costa wrote:
Chris_CE wrote:Indeed Transport could use some alternative routes, even if they're right next to each other.

One issue with a track like FIC Outpost or Industrial is that the alternate routes completely separate the racers, and therefore decrease interaction and excitement

im not sure about that. the ability to choose the path its something intresting in combat scenario, dodge assassin by using another path, or avoid combat in general, it might also been used to catchup someone or other purposes, and if i remember correctly transport and acrofobia are the only one without a secondary path.....to me i think every track should have at least one at some point, just to vary the gameplay[/quote

+1 Costa - I liked how in rollcage one path might be longer but allow you to catch up with speed pads, shorter paths might be slower and more technical, some paths might have power ups and be more tricky to manoeuvre where others are easy to get through.

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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby Chris_CE » Mon Jun 05, 2017 4:29 pm

Indeed, it's nice to have alternate paths, but sometimes you can have too many, and it separates players for too long, with little action. And combat is the other half of the game next to racing
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twisted
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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby twisted » Mon Jun 05, 2017 8:32 pm

Hi Chris,

It have nothing to do with these tracks but when do you think you will fix the Yuri Industrial map? These issues really bugs me since the beginning:

- The idea of this corner is good on paper but poorly executed as the turn is not fun, specially these two jumps... there is absolutely no benefits to take them:
Image

- Another problem is these two arches are really in the way... they should be higher as I'm always crashing into them when exiting from upside down the big and smaller tunnels.
Image
Image

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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby TheOnLY » Mon Jun 05, 2017 9:21 pm

For the first one: Have you tried to simply not jump? You can go down the ramp without losing contact to the ground and use the boost pad on the inside if navigated properly. It is one of my favorite corners of the game for that very reason.
For the second one: Try the new launch ability, it works wonders with getting from the ceiling to the floor faster.
Last edited by TheOnLY on Tue Jun 06, 2017 12:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby kingbeandip » Tue Jun 06, 2017 12:47 pm

twisted wrote:Hi Chris,

It have nothing to do with these tracks but when do you think you will fix the Yuri Industrial map? These issues really bugs me since the beginning:

- The idea of this corner is good on paper but poorly executed as the turn is not fun, specially these two jumps... there is absolutely no benefits to take them:

- Another problem is these two arches are really in the way... they should be higher as I'm always crashing into them when exiting from upside down the big and smaller tunnels.


In the first picture I like the ramp and the concrete pad that gets in the way. And in the first picture with the two things that stick up, causing you to fly into them at full speed, I like those two. In both cases they add difficulty, and can be avoided with practice. In the latter case for example, you can let off the gas while flying (jet power) to adjust the position where you land.

As a general rule, I am opposed to making changes to the older tracks because I feel like they have already had time to go through the full development cycle, they have their own personalities already, and I would prefer to give the developers as much time as possible to work on new content. I'd rather have 10 great tracks than 5 perfect ones.

If these were supposed to be easier tracks, I'd probably agree with you, but I like the variety in difficulty.

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Re: Suggestions to improve Transport and Alhatra maps

Postby Chris_CE » Thu Jun 08, 2017 5:46 pm

Only's got a point about launching. It can bring you down from a ceiling much quicker.

I must say though, I really like landing in between those two arches in the 3rd screenshot. You can control your thrust in mid air, so sometimes I can pull it off.

I agree that the corner in the first image is a bit weird with the glowing ramps there. The concrete with the barrels is not meant to be a viable route, it's just for visual flare when someone shoots and sets off the barrels. But the ramps on the top right are generally useless if you want to actually compete.

I may have a look down the line, but kingbeandip is right about needing new tracks
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